National Party leader Christopher Luxon in RNZ's Christchurch studio for an extended pre-election interview with Morning Report. Photo: RNZ / Anna Sargent
National leader Christopher Luxon has defended his party's policy about voters possibly going back to the polls if National fails to reach a coalition agreement with NZ First.
The trend in recent polls has been to show National and ACT would need NZ First support to form a coalition.
Last month the National Party leader said he would work with NZ First and its leader Winston Peters, but at the weekend the party's campaign manager Chris Bishop said a hung parliament and a second election were on the cards.
In an extended interview with Morning Report, Luxon said he backed himself to work with whoever he needed to in order to reach a coalition agreement.
Luxon said there was always uncertainty around any MMP election and National would be working with the parties that Kiwis delivered on election night "to get that change that they want done done".
"I've managed very complex executive teams with very big personalities" National leader Chris Luxon
Asked why after saying National would work with NZ First, it was now saying this might not be possible, Luxon said he would be trying hard and he was confident he could secure a deal.
"I've been a CEO, I've managed very complex executive teams with very big personalities."
Pressed further on the difficulty of securing a deal with Peters, Luxon said: "We're just raising the fact that there is uncertainty in any MMP election, right. There always is, every MMP election is very very close and all we're saying to New Zealanders is look, avoid any uncertainty, don't take a risk on Labour, Te Pāti Māori and the Greens, party vote National.
"I'll make it work with whatever New Zealand delivers for us."
He accused Labour leader Chris Hipkins of being "a negative Nellie" who was focusing on National's policies and its leader instead of fighting the election on his own record.
Luxon disagreed that by announcing two weeks ago he would work with NZ First he had made a mistake and cost National some support.
He repeated his position that MMP elections produced unclear results at times and he was appealing to voters to opt for a "strong, stable government", saying National had "common sense policies" to deal with the challenges Kiwis were facing.
Asked if National could tolerate a cross-party deal (support for confidence and then getting agreement issue by issue) with either ACT or NZ First Luxon replied: "It's just not going to happen ... the bottom line is National and ACT have worked well together in the past, David Seymour and I have a good personal relationship..."
They were aligned on the economy, law and order, health and education and while they might disagree on the means to bring about positive changes they would debate them in "a very mature responsible way".
"We will make it work because New Zealand now needs delivery."
Later in the day Luxon agreed a second election was unlikely.
Asked at a media briefing in Rangiora if he was trying to scare the public into not voting for NZ First he said he had been urging people to party vote National for weeks.
Told that Seymour had again raised the possibility of a cross-party arrangement and that the referendum on Te Tiriti o Waitangi principles was ACT's top issue Luxon again repeated that the National-ACT government would offer strong stable government. He also ruled out a referendum on the treaty, saying it would be "divisive" for the country.
Claim on new election 'scaremongering' - Peters
Winston Peters Photo: Newshub Nation / Warner Bros Discovery ANZ
Peters told Morning Report it was "extraordinary" and a sign of panic that Chris Bishop had raised the possibility of a new election which had subsequently been backed by Luxon and ACT leader David Seymour as part of their strategy.
It was irresponsible in the extreme, in part because around 500,000 people had already voted, he said.
"It just demonstrates that people are going to need experience in the next government ... what we're hearing now is not rational, it's scaremongering, it's not true."
Peters used Germany as an example where negotiations in 2017 to form a new government took five months.
He laughed when asked if he took it "as a slight personally" that National might not be able to form a government.
He added that National's support was slipping and they were panicking in the face of a switch to NZ First.
"This is straight out scaremongering with no credibility whatsoever and I think New Zealanders understand that."
"What we're hearing now is not rational" NZ First leader Winston Peters
It's like a marriage - Seymour
ACT leader David Seymour said he was confident the strong personal relationship between Luxon and himself would be a good basis for a stable government despite their policy differences.
The country needed "a change of direction" he told a media briefing in Wellington this afternoon. He compared a National-ACT deal to a marriage, with each partner having their own identity and purpose while making the relationship work.
"And I think we're going to be great partners."
He blamed Labour for stirring the pot and said both he and Luxon were intent on a change of government that would set the country in a new direction.
'Inward and insular' place in the world
During the Morning Report interview Luxon said New Zealand had lost some standing in the world in the last few years by taking an "inward and insular" approach.
"We actually haven't been out there hustling and doing what we do best which is that we punch above our weight - we're in the forums, we're making contributions, we're externally oriented, we're engaged in the world and we need to be."
As a small trading nation, the country needed to be more visible.
He agreed former prime minister Jacinda Ardern had a high international profile and he admired that.
He wanted to get the country out in the world doing more trade and it had "droppped the ball" using India as an example. Australia, Canada, the EU and the UK had been progressing their trading relationships with the world's most populous country in a much deeper way, he said.
It was a market he knew well amd he wanted businesses to have the confidence to pursue trade deals with it.
"I want us to get out of our internal inward looking mindset that we've had in the last six years and lift our sights, and lift some ambition and aspiration and go out in the world and be positive about ourselves."
He said he had not given any thought to take a ministerial role in this area himself.
Luxon said the attacks by Hamas on Israel were "shocking" and there was no justification for them, adding Israel had a clear right to defend itself.
"There is massive suffering being inflicted on innocent civilians and Israel has the right to defend itself, it's that simple."
He criticised the government's response, with Foreign Affairs Minister Nanaia Mahuta's initial "soft" response and then Hipkins saying later on Sunday he had not even spoken with Mahuta. Luxon said this "very confusing from the New Zealand government".
He was clear that National still favoured the two-state solution for the Palestinians and Israel to be achieved "peacably and diplomatically".
On tax cuts
Luxon said he has no regrets on the party's tax policy despite it being questioned by economists, Goldman Sachs and other political parties.
He disagreed the tax policy has been "mired in controversy" and said it had been well thought through.
Kiwis deserved tax cuts to help cope with the high cost of living.
"It's a great policy," he said.
"I think the disappointing part about the campaign has been that there's just been massive amounts of negativity and personal attacks from Labour," he said, accusing it of releasing a small amount of policy.
"It has no record to run with and as a result there has been no ideas."
On his vision for where New Zealand could be in 2040, he wanted the country to be one of the world's leading small advanced countries. It would need to lift its productivity, care for its vulnerable communities and it would need to have made serious progress on cutting its emissions.
The reality of delivering better services to match those in the likes of Australia, Ireland and Denmark lay in improving the country's economy, he said.